係咪要搵一兩個星期，一兩個月，一兩年，成個香港 d 警察，保安，消防，律師，醫生.....etc 罷晒工，你地先醒嘅呢？嘜得你個個咁安全，日日行出街去 we rat，去返工返學拍拖唱 K 行街睇戲都安全無事？人地孖囡 d 相放晒上網，你估天真咁簡單！背後不知幾黑暗！一隻二隻返屋企問吓你地 d 呀媽，擔唔擔心你地著埋晒哩 d T恤啦！講嚟講去，掉番轉，黑社會都有呀媽生，個 d 呀媽都唔想佢地 d 仔女係黑社會呀！你問心答點解啦！唉！

Aiko Sunoo .. either type in chinese, or accept the way that you need to improve through critics by other people. I am not native english speaker. But.. notice that

"ACtually you even don't know what the definition of them are,"
<-->
"Actually you don't even know their deifinition"
English speaks in short way, in general, comparing to Cantonese.

警方決定不予起訴「住好Ｄ」的東主楊志超、設計師及售貨員，管有三合會有關物品的罪名。主要是他們沒有三合會背景，有關用品也不是宣傳三合會用途。
http://hk.news.yahoo.com/080117/60/2nazo.html

>Aiko Sunoo

「忽視基礎理論的重要性」

這種太硬的term是沒有人會理會的.

所以我的term這種情況是

「嚮往冇根基既成功」.同「移植別人的結果就可以」

這兩種想法吧？？

後者就是批評GOD的道理了...在我自己看來就是寫上14k就是黑社會的論斷的理由吧？？

>Nowhere
這種講法是相當「逆天」的...笑.人總是害怕不知道的東西.如果社團可以有制服.就會變成制服社團了吧？？那不是更容易控制呢？？
現在警察所做的只是加強黑社會的恐怖.對對抗他們冇幫助的.
讓黑社會變成社會禁忌.太概只會令好人更害怕.小孩更嚮往吧？？

其實只要知道早些年14K(還是其他社團?忘了.)曾經真的試過自製"制服"讓成員穿上, 這就不難明白為甚麼這次要執法了, 無論在"阻嚇"上或者"一視同仁"上.

> 持書者

因為香港人大多忽視理論基礎承繼的重要性

所以就算中化和美術拿A的人也可能只會自圓其說,但未必知道沿革和起源

創意原是應用哲學中方法學 (methodology)的重要課題,但市民大多連批判思維的 Source (Marx's Critical Theory)也不明所以。因此我們應該繼續綜合分析其他地區的成功案例。(eg: AS General Studies Examination)

我覺得
身為香港人要評論何為創意
係沒有甚麼資格的

因為他們根本看不起別人的創造

尤其是無形的價值

同意屋主所言 , 警方未免過份高調去拉人封舖......

件tee 不太覺得有咩創意云云.........

"設計是甚麼?其實不是製作一些別人不敢/不會做/嘩眾取寵的事而是製作設合用者需求的事物"

不能同意肥雞的看法
如果你有留意G.O.D.是sell香港地道文化
粗口、黑社會等次文化也是地道文化之一
所以我不認為這就是嘩眾取寵

希望你弄清楚一件事
人人需求不同
總會有客人找到設合自己需求的事物
因為G.O.D.並不是只Serve一個Client
你的concept是對
但要了解重點
他的Target Audience是何許人?
斷不會是那些不會欣賞本地文化
穿件14k tee出街炫耀一番的人吧?
這才叫做嘩眾取寵
不要讀死書

長篇大論的回應沒看

或者說早己看得太多了

歸根結底是香港人對黑社會的恐懼和警察有組織地助長這種恐懼

我認為這種政策的目的不是壓止黑社會.而是限制結社自由

>留言板不是討論區, 屋主可考慮嚴禁回應別人評論

命題錯誤

Discussion of above nomenclature is surely beyond the theme of this blog entry. Also, if Ben Ng will \"buy\" what you have said, the liberality and freedom of opinion will be gone.

As a Western saying goes:

\\\\\\\"Although I do not identify with what you have said, I will strive to protect your right of speech even if I would lose my life in return\\\\\\\".


That is what Ben Ng says:
本博客以學術討論及分享為主要目的

Are you want to monopolize the discussion/talk by proposing banning deed?

>(1) 行動是基於一條過時的法例
同意, 法例應不時更新, 更應不斷廢除

>(2) 設計是誤踏法律灰色地帶而已，執法者用不著這麽高調及重手。
同意, 現任公安局長鄧乜乜有濫權傾向, 若最終不被起訴或判無罪, 市民應踢佢下台

另, 留言板不是討論區, 屋主可考慮嚴禁回應別人評論

>警察

If they have NEVER studied social sciences apart from law, you cannot expect that they will give a fair account of a case, as they have absolute power which can ruin their justice.

雖不敢評論此法是否過時，
但亦有耳聞過一些個別事件
如一個年輕道友在一個唔應該出現既地方出現
當被警察截獲後他同個警察講佢係「老同」（術語，即道友或吸毒者）
但警察不由就裡的就以涉嫌自稱為三合會成員罪拘捕佢。
這個CASE我是在一個社工的口中聽來的（當然姓名、身份失奉）
但在這個CASE看到警察在執行此法時可能是寧枉莫縱的心態做事，這可能會使之形成一種過於嚴苛的局面，從而使良法變成惡法

不少年輕人胡亂"響朵"遭到黑幫襲擊已經不是新聞了。

穿著這件黑幫名字的衣服，會不會飛來橫禍，我不敢說。

Extended reading:

http://appledaily.atnext.com/template/apple/art_ma...

http://appledaily.atnext.com/template/apple/art_ma...

說到創意，真正的御宅族是會把 creative thinking and analytical thinking 綜合運用的。

看見以下 powerpoint slides (Introduction to Lolita-ism (羅莉坦現象)) 和模擬試卷，我相信許多受眾都會像我般被其比少女更複雜的思維嚇窒!：

http://doraemonserv.mysinablog.com/index.php?op=Ar...

可惜的是，許多 Miniforum 的人一見到它們是 doraemonserv[2]  寫的就認定他寫火星文，不願重視其文內涵!

But I do not accept some of his sets of opinion, especially for some negative comments on Ben Ng! And he forgets to proofread his PDFs!

> 求其做d 野就可以推上創作的高地?之後用\\\\\\\"打擊創意\\\\\\\"\\\\\\\"扼殺創意\\\\\\\"保護自己?
這和明光社的道德高地有甚麼分別

True, both police and the 14K Tishirt producers know only protecting their own interests instead of whole-hearted negotiation.

所以在此事件上直接說出自己的真實感受就足夠了。
可是當我嘗試問部分港大其他系同學( NOT department of social science)，他們竟回答：
這些通識野唔關我事......

如果把這些受眾對14K事件的漠不關心態度引申至推廣動漫文化，這正好說中了御宅族嘗試向大眾作 communicative bridge 的困境：

１．  受眾無心受啟蒙，但求安逸於自己固有的價值定型;
２．  許多人際關係霸權（例如教會)會干涉論述者以大小通吃地操縱當中可剝奪的利益（包括信任);
３，  受眾很少會集中於特定角度解讀，但經常向論述者的身份認同動手腳（例如老屈佢博出位）;

哲學家們把這種種harder puzzle 歸納（induce, 劉君燦取其直譯為感應)為命名／命題問題(nomenclature problems)。利用Java Programming Concepts作類比, 論述者的資料型態裝載器的名稱（identifiers)撞正保留字，整個高階物件導向程式 hang 哂!

Practice make perfect. After the police have teach them an lesson (the teaching quality is UNCL) they wll know how to do better.

For example, they may play on numbers such as seven , nine, fourteen, 168, 5354 and so on.
---------------------
求其做d 野就可以推上創作的高地?之後用\"打擊創意\"\"扼殺創意\"保護自己?
這和明光社的道德高地有甚麼分別

沒空看完全部回應
只說自己感覺

我本身也是設計人(不敢自稱為師)
但這事件上,我不認為警方有大錯
錯只是反應過激,其實要求回收已可以

設計是甚麼?其實不是製作一些別人不敢/不會做/嘩眾取寵的事
而是製作設合用者需求的事物
14k,有多少人會很有興趣穿上身?
坦白說,我一定不會
設計者的用意何在?
我敢肯定,他覺得這個設計夠"嘩眾",亦能"取"得某些喜歡標奇立異的人的"寵"
事實上,這件t設計老套,用色差,不是印上14k如此嘩眾的字
會有多少人留意?
警方有如此行動真的是因為怕人不安嗎?當然不是吧!
應該是想讓市民知道有那些是不可以開玩笑的
希望大家能嚴肅對待黑社會這課題
而不是可以被商家用來嘩眾取寵的
即使古惑仔,內容也不會有真實黑社會的名稱
說實在,你在美國穿一件印有拉登頭象的t走到警察面前,不知會怎樣呢?恐怕會被他們玩殘吧

>>san4
每件案件都有自己的內容。
中五名考生犯案和普通中學生犯案，根本是兩入案件，兩個內容，請不要以單純的結果去判斷法官是否錯誤。法官的資料一定比普通人的多，如果只是以自己看到的結果，去估計和質疑法官有否判錯是否適合。

>>薄荷朱古力
黑社會文化是否消失？我可以告訴你？在我以前的工作裡，有人以黑社會會員而判罪的，也有人以自稱黑社會會員而被判的，真的消失嗎？穿衣服而嚇人的就沒有，但『自稱黑社會』嚇人的就肯定有......

各位冷靜反問一下自己，是以什麼角度去看事情？看到事情的真相有多少？肯定法例過時的人心裡只是『覺得過時』還是『真的過時』。
法例是否過時？我自己就不會判別。

> 我希望知道閣下以英文發言的原因何在

部分英文語言系統詞彙在中文語言系統是找不到準確的詮釋的:

e.g,:

Hysteria

Humour

Spontaneity

Idiograms

因此,為保原意,我習慣了用英文想和寫...

許多中文詞彙會發生更多一詞多義的情況, 例如:

精神:

1. meaning Spirit
2. meaning principles
3. meaning style
4. meaning a set of belief

所以目前為止中英並用也許可以解決語意學上的歧義問題。

> 薄荷朱古力  & 知日部屋屋主

見解一針見血,也令我明白在言行上有甚麼地方需要改善。

一段來說,我們可以用六帽子思考法對創意成效進行全面分析:


http://www.mindtools.com/pages/article/newTED_07.h...

白:資料分析
紅:感受探索
黑:預期以外的影響
黃:正面/預期效果
綠:新觀點/意念藍本
藍:流程及方法學


日後如果找到任何新觀點會在此略談。

>亞力
那個展品因為是透過立體展品方式展出
因此從另一個角度看的確有相關嫌疑
另,這是我數年前從蘋果上得知的報導
因此很多細節都忘掉,請見諒

如果沒這次事件
我也不知是14K是黑社會的黨名

我想這次事件
也可以看到不同的東西吧

以我理解
G.O.D. 應該不會被告
但是警方以穿著14K T-SHIRT 會被視為黑社會的一分子(或者說穿著這衫會有一種令人意識到穿者是黑社會的人), 而視之為宣稱自己為黑社會, 便會觸犯法例.
那怎麼才算創意，怎樣才算犯法呢?

所以這次警方便先行出擊
沒收了那堆14K T-SHIRT
以表示 暗示(或是明示?) 自己是黑社會的人是不可行的

如者說
如果將14K 字樣變成 "我是黑社會" 字樣的話
警方這次的行動會更廣為人接受吧

>薄荷朱古力
>說到納粹的徽章問題，不知道在德國的佛教團體該怎麼辦(總會有一兩間吧！？)很好奇的說。

佛教的"萬"字印與納粹的徽章是有很明顯的分別的; 納粹的徽章是斜45度, 而且與"萬"字印是左右相反的. 所以不容易搞錯.

>小櫻的kero
說到納粹的徽章問題，不知道在德國的佛教團體該怎麼辦(總會有一兩間吧！？)很好奇的說。

就我記憶所及,
在德國曾經舉辦過一個德國和香港的文化交流展覽
香港曾經有人嘗試以一排卍字作為展覽品
被德方以"倒過來看是納粹黨徽章"為由
禁制該展品的展出
>Aiko Sunoo
我希望知道閣下以英文發言的原因何在,
並希望閣下作出中文翻譯,
這裡是中文blog,
而受眾亦多為中國人,
在方便最多數的網民的基本禮貌之下
是不是應該用中文發言呢?
如果閣下認為我是此blog中一位以英文發言著稱的網民
抱歉!
你猜錯了!
如閣下認為閣下的判斷沒有任何問題的話,
請提出切實可信的證據
另外,我本人雖然不是中大學生
但亦對閣下在2007/11/04 17:27 的發言深感不悅
還請屋主作出定奪

近日忙得連睡覺時間也不夠。對此事我在本文只是簡單說了幾句內心的感受，沒有說出原因。我覺得很有討論的價值及反思的空間，想不到貼出後並不見多少汵靜的討論及反思，甚至淪為罵戰及人身攻擊，這是十分可惜的。

我對此事的看法，一言蔽之：(1) 行動是基於一條過時的法例 (2) 設計是誤踏法律灰色地帶而已，執法者用不著這麽高調及重手。

無論各人立場如何，也許是時候一起靜下來思考。

> 為反對而反對

慢著!這裡的討論者都有一共同目的－－盡量闡明１４ｋ事件的灰色地帶（當然，某一被我嚴厲批判而著草的港女例外）

你可以說我是打圓場，方便大家下台－－這是必然的，最佳的討論結果是大家能帶出初步的共識。

又來了，又是「為反對而反對」這種虛無飄渺的帽子。好像每一次關於政府政策的討論都會有人提出這個。問題是，有人真的能能證明反對者真的是每一個政府政策和行動都持反對態度的嗎？

若你是假設反對者都是吃飽飯沒事做的話，這討論的確是多餘了。

改善法例，修改僵化，不合時宜的制度，當然是立法會議員的職責。但若沒有民間的討論，議員和政府又怎聽得見民間的聲音？

「如果律政司就呢樣野起訴G.O.D，再講呢句都未遲，可惜，到呢一秒你都只能夠繼續你既假設、假設同埋假設。」

你好像弄混了，那一句是支持警察行動的人所提出的。根本上在這裡的討論（例如這t-shirt對社會的影響）都是基於假設。合理的假設，是基於事實根據。若以對方的論點都是假設（不論對方的假設合理性）而無視對方的論點的話，這根本就不是討論。

> 薄荷朱古力

I have just played ONS with doraemonserv[2] and fortunately I observed your unveiling of truth. I totally identify with this because I believe that police are only working for some even more authoritarian parties and their behaviours are usually small-lane (小道). Their thinking systems are also absurd: they know how to protect copyright for business's profits but never understand the original principle of copyright - prevent plagiarism/doujinization(抄人 ideas).

>xelein
反對的人根本就不清楚警察和黑社會的運作情況
希望我們如何清楚呀?
你知道我們香港人當中有多少熟知黑社會文化嗎?
你知道我們香港人當中有多少看過警務指引嗎?
我可以告訴你!
黑社會文化老早在香港人心中消亡
你說什麼黑社會術語,手勢等等,不是溶入日常生活中
就是完全斷絕繼承
而警務手冊(忘記了正式名稱)更加是警察秘不外傳的手冊
(可笑的是,就連警員也是數人共享一本的手冊
但警方偏偏就在一大堆委員會當中套用,
但又不清楚說明當中內容,
公眾希望獲得時警方有種以"機密"為由不對外公佈
害我以為警方才是什麼秘密社團)
而只要加入相當程度詳細的黑社會資料的電影
三級是逃不掉的,在此情形下
希望我們如何清楚黑社會和警隊呀?

Regarding how CL&C exam setters, including the ignorant masterhead, 馮祿德, strangle pluralism, Syaoran in CUHKACS has the same feeling as me and he has already written an article on this matter:

http://www.inmediahk.net/public/article?item_id=53...

   即使像《情與中國文化》，把西方文化完全視為wonder，東（中）方就論述作concern的二元劃分，你答題時亦不要大幅度的推翻原文。身為整個社會、文化中一個主要部分的政治，被完全抽出來，文化思考變成「假、大、空」的虛談。

   香港的大商家，不少有「數字迷信」，因為他們可以只看最終的數字結果，不問過程。教育，偏偏就是一樣講求過程重於結果的東西。聽過電台節目的中訪問和phone-in，大家必會感受到香港這種「教育為考試服務」所引起的荒謬。

連問題也令人摸不着頭腦，同學難以捕捉改卷員的偏向，只好把文化科視為吹水科，不必溫習，由它戰死沙場。

So the HK-er\\\'s mindset, especially who have matriculation course finished since 1994, including some police involved in 14K incident, are made simple and naive. What a shame!

Note: Syaoran is a prolific Chinese linguistic learners, an anime fan as well as an experienced cosplayer.

> 無論立場係咪一政，都仲依然期待緊屋主既回應。

Whether he will reply is not important as he say that CUHK's administration workloads have already pressed him a lot and he would probably have meagre free time after even posting a new entry. So we may expect he will publish a formal thesis on comparative study between current ideology between Hong Kong and Japan for all learners (莘莘學子).

> 退一百步講
美感欠奉
在創意方面也不見高章

Practice make perfect. After the police have teach them an lesson (the teaching quality is UNCL) they wll know how to do better.

For example, they may play on numbers such as seven , nine, fourteen, 168, 5354 and so on.

I can see since Ben Ng has unwelcomed doraemonserv[2] owing to his inappropiate use of word, many of the audience (except Au Yeung, an Ph.D-to-be of sociology and many of Ben Ng\'s net pals) have been neglecting the important of study and self-actualization. As doraemonserv[2]\'s girlfriend (I am older than him), I will inherit his teaching ideals (教育理念) to inspire as many innocent(純真) audience as possible.


Recommended reading for 14-K issue reference available in public librariies:

1. 主宰 支配社會的人文法則 by expose press, 2007-04
2. Introduction to Social Psychology (2nd ed) by Longman/Pearson press, 2005

Welcome to raise any questions here or via the guestbook of http://www.xanga.com/kokone_yumiko  and I will try my best to give the solution to your puzzles.

> 只是表達普通意見...

You have unsatisfactory concepts of phinology & philology as well as etymology. Nothign can be simply classifiied as right or wrong EXCEPT FOR concepts and principles because they are the schemas (stantards of scheme) for all running process including thinking and writing!

普通 is an erratic translation of the English: General

many pronounce the \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"Gen-\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" prefix like generator,
actually it must be pronounced like genetics.

General is the common substitute of adjectives meaning the same as Generic (共通).

In liberal studies and all sciences we always claims for generic skills such as team spirit, self-management and fundamental knowledges consolidations.

So for you to say \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"普通意見\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\", this is okey, provided that your saying is applicable for all cases.

NEVER tell me that general opinion means common sense - this is nonsense in Logic and Philosophy.

For example (proof by contradiction)

Many say that \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"Otakus=hikikomori\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" is a general thing

But the founder of GAINAX, Okada Toshio, the king of otaku (otaking) has manifested to all Japanese that he has paid very hard work in sociology and humanity care by producing an anime called EVA of high educational values. Hence he is a public figure, and the hikiomori label is N/A for him.

Therefore the crux of the problem lies on the nonchalant attitude of the audience. Usually politicans make use of common sense to control the general public\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'s mindset to maximize their profits.

So if time permits, try reading more references as many as you can transdisciplinarily and you can practise 一理通百理明 as most of the okada-ian otakus do as routine.

>不太見到甚麼解構及批判問題能力

ACtually you even don't know what the definition of them are, and you are just 缺乏容忍包容 plus 上綱上線.

Let me clarify them:

解構:

Reinvention

using theoretical frameworks to identify elements of an ideology


批判:

Criitical Analysis

NOT commemting on or critizie on things. It simply means the spirit of scholarship about the willingness to provide multifaceted perspectives on an issue and try the best to explore all the possibilities and limitations, finally suggests possible moves to breakthough the barrier of commuinications.

Many used to treat 批判 as a means to unleash their own opinion which are to some extent counter-productive. Actually, 批判 is always applied in Pure Sciences in which many scientists have to solve many harder problems such as partial differentiation of polyjective functions and energy crisis.

Focusing on 14-K event, the most difficult aspect for all social science learners (including sociology and cultural studies) is to build up and deliberate and comprehensive discouses on the source and impact of alll of the ideologies (perceptable objects) involved.

Get it? Any Problem? Don't be scared off. Just challange me by saying something!

BTW, we cannot just use mutually exclusive rough judgment schemes by sayiing one is good and bad. In professors marking of scripts, even if you cite an theory correctly he can still give you a BIG CROSS, not meaning that you are WRONG but telling you that your methods actually exacerbate the problems.

> SAMY

According to your name provided, you may be a girl as me.

> 陪別人瘋夠~浪費時間,閃了~

You are proving that you are liar as well as konggirl - you know, all girls like us already have greatest original sin including ignorance and lust. Your shameless, irresponsible abuse of rights to voicing opinion make a great stigma to Hong Kong\'s modern culture & women who strives for gender equality via liberal feminism.

As Cantonese saying said:

先撩者賤,打死無怨

面係人地俾,架係自己丟

Also I observe that you even do not have conscious of 禮義廉恥 as you don\'t know how to shut up in time.

So you are to blame by all of audience here plus mass media (Appledaily will report this soon!). It is you who refuse my wholehearted advice on you for introspetion so you cannot claim anything as you ask for trouble.

To me, I will NEVER use junk to describe you. Instead, you are but like an untreatable toxic heavy soluble metal waste which is freely flown to 學海 - then .... 利用無知和偏見毒害知識分子. If I behave like you in university, the professors will, I am sure, do me up.

> 多度自改留言=>不負責任(非改錯字)

Logical fallacy of irrelevant conclusion: data type not matched.

I edit my words for proofreading purpuse as well as polishing my word. But I do not see any evidence of your uttering for striving improvements.

I can only said that for all students and teachers, 無知就是罪惡, 知識就是力量

We will try our best to better you if you sincerely confess that you are not competent enough, but I am quite helpness toward you because you are quite stubborn and arrogant.


I understand that you want to show off your traits but you are not prolific enough.